Project:General Discussions/Archive: Difference between revisions

Just add the rendering tag after filename. If you are editing a wiki page that use Infobox VG, change the thumbnail to fit in this template. I will edit this in all of my future commits. [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] 20:25, 20 October 2010 (UTC)

In last days this wiki was attacked by bots that was posting massive spam in the wiki pages. We could implement the [http://www.google.com/recaptcha ReCaptcha] system, if these bots try to create accounts or try to edit wiki pages without an account, they will be permanently blocked (currently doesn't exist any bot that can bypass reCaptcha).  [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] 14:01, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

*Something is wrong since the reCaptcha isn't blocking these bots edition and user creation. We must find another way to block these spammers. [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] 16:07, 27 January 2011 (CET)

This problem is caused by the compression method, if you experience this bug again, try to save the same image in PNG format (better quality and doesn't have this issue). [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] 19:18, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

*This was a server issue. Mamario already fixed this. [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] 16:07, 27 January 2011 (CET)

Apparently this issue appeared after site admin updated to Mediawiki 1.6. The current workaround that I've encountered is reuploading the image with resizing problems in PNG format. (I'm not sure if GIF have this bug too) [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] 22:33, 7 December 2010 (CET)

After tests I confirm that all images format have this issue, I've notified this to Mamario. Now we have to wait for a answer, so some covers that I've recently updated will have this problem, please no revert these files. [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] 15:53, 10 December 2010 (CET)

* Mamario fixed this. I've notified too of some images that can't be resized, and he is looking for a solution. [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] 13:18, 11 December 2010 (CET)

I've noticed that Mediawiki 1.6 support more templates, and apparently the GameCube list is working OK, even with all templates included. For help, I've too moved all links and references to the obsolete Ratings to the new RatingsGC, to reduce templates in use by GameCube page. [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] 22:33, 7 December 2010 (CET)

*No fix, after mergering htp://dolphin-emu.com and http://dolphin-emulator.com, the server that is hosting this wiki was changed and accepted a few more templates, but the issue still occur [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] 16:07, 27 January 2011 (CET)

We seem to have an influx of users who don't pay attention to listed issues when providing test entries or compatibility ratings. Jhonn and I have been rolling back/updating most of these as they occur, but it's becoming a bit annoying. We've tended to leave test entries alone, but there are now a number of "no known glitches" test entries for games that clearly still have issues. Do folks have any suggestions regarding ways to improve the handling of such?

Now, we have a better spam blocker powered by reCaptcha, but some pages needs to be updated since some pages moved to other locations (in fact, all pages of "Dolphin Emulator Wiki" namespace was moved to "Project" namespace). Also, any link to the old server (dolphin-emulator.com) should be changed to the new site (dolphin-emu.org)... | [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

: About the test entries, they're built based on a predefined table (from the template)... Before the server change, I've implemented show/hide functionality to the navigation templates ([[Template:Navigation]]). The navigation templates are based on tables too, so, implementing this functionality to the test entries shouldn't be hard... Adding this to the To Do - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:: Ta Daa, all testing entries of the wiki now are collapsible and, by default, load hidden when someone access the page. The only thing changed was the table header and a new line was added because we can't choose in which column the show/hide "button" appear (it'll be always the first). Looked better and more suggestive for me having a row named "Test entries" (or whatever you guys want to) with the button than having the button on the side of Revision column collapsing all other columns together... Any suggestion or objection? Something you guys think that need to be changed? - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

::: I have not much to add since it's perfect in my eyes. Very clean solution aswell. Nice job Jhonn! -[[User:Garteal|Garteal]] ([[User talk:Garteal|talk]]) 21:38, 6 November 2012 (CET)

: Second, since some pages have only Videos and others have only Screenshots, I think we should merge the two sections in only one section named "Media Gallery, using the standard 300px size for thumbnails, etc. Actually, I commited an example in the [[Resident_Evil/sandbox|sandbox of Resident Evil]], the screenshots have a little big margin and aren't aligned with the videos, but in case we use this concept, I would make a template to simplify the usage of the screenshots (something like [[Template:YouTube]], requiring only file name and caption) and add the proper CSS styles to make videos and screenshots aligned. What do you guys think about these suggestions? - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

Whoa, that was fast Jhonn. Sweet! I really like the testing work. Though it might be nice if it remained the whole length of the page when collapsed, for consistency, but that's just nitpicking. I disagree with you on the '''tester''' column. It goes to an automatically generated contribs page here on the wiki, not to a forum link or anything else. That's why there aren't any red links right now. I think it's nice, cause it shows who made the edit, and what else that person did. I like it. As for your ideas for the media gallery, I'm all for it. Most pages only have a few videos anyway. But yea, it will need to have the alignment fixed and stuff for that. Today is a little busy, with voting and all, but I'll jump into the work as soon as I can. - [[User:MaJoR|MaJoR]] ([[User talk:MaJoR|talk]]) 23:30, 6 November 2012 (CET)

:In this case, let's leave the tester column as it is now. After the forum integration is complete it would be nice to provide a comment somewhere warning the visitors to only add her/his nickname on the tester column if he/she have a wiki account corresponding to this nickname, so, we avoid the red links. Just to be sure: when you say "it might be nice if it remained the whole length of the page when collapsed" you are referring to the table width right? In this case, a simple CSS style should do the trick... I'll (try to) fix this and also mess around with the alignment and position between videos and screenshots when I get more free time, so we can finish a standard for the upcoming media gallery - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:I like the media gallery suggestion Jhonn. I do think there has to be a limit though. Also pondering about what MaJoR suggested. Perhaps we should limit it to screenshots only? Or if we also want videos, there should be a maximum limit of 3 of them or so. What will we do to the rest? Delete them? Or link them somewhere below the embedded? --[[User:Garteal|Garteal]] ([[User talk:Garteal|talk]]) 13:13, 7 November 2012 (CET)

:If we don't have a cap, it will increase the loading time of the page depending on the number of screenshots and their quality(lossless PNGs, etc). Imagine if there's like 10 3MB shots in there. In order to address that, we either have to limit the screenshots to JPG only to reduce the filesizes and loading times, or have a reasonable cap. I like the 200px size for screenshots. The only thing that remains is the padding of it, which iirc, Jhonn was going to address. As for the videos, the three that should be embedded have to be recorded without any emulator glitches (if possible) and has to be high quality videos (if possible). We'll have one video for each type, eg: one video showing the gameplay, one the intro, one shows the battles. 300px seems reasonable to me. And yes, I like the cleaner approach as well, so good job on that MaJoR. As for the screenshots category, are they meant to show a giant gallery of every games' screenshots? - [[User:Garteal|Garteal]] ([[User talk:Garteal|talk]]) 13:16, 8 November 2012 (CET)

:: Well, I already fixed the alignment issue on YouTube template (this means that if you embed videos using youtube template and images thumbnails of the same size, they'll be aligned properly now). I'm still trying to develop a template to randomly select 3 videos (whenever a visitor access the page) and put the rest of the videos (if exist) as links. I'm trying to make it without using expensive parser functions, but implementing this aren't so easy. In the last case, we can embed only one Video thumbnail but instead of using a single video ID we use the ID of a playlist containing all videos of that game, or, search in MediaWiki for a Video Gallery extension (that we may ask for some site admin install) or some extension that make possible of doing a template that works like the Kolano suggestion (for me, the best until now). About the WIP Image Template, I can add an parameter for setting thumbnail type (like bug, image gallery, screenshot, etc.) and then we hardcode the thumbnail size directly in the template (like XXX px for bug, YYY px for screenshots, etc.). The most important part is to keep using small templates like YouTube and the WIP Image to make easier changing thumbnails size, position, etc in the future. For example, if all testing entries from the wiki has been hardcoded in every game page instead of being included through a template, making them collapsible would need editing every single game page (like we'll need to do when the media gallery standard is set). Since we used a template, a simple change in the template source made all game pages have collapsible test entries - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

The media gallery will have both videos and screenshots right? If so, that would be a bit cleaner. Having only one category, with three videos on top, followed by countless screenshots. As for the limit, I think we've all mostly agreed to having 3 as a limit. I agree, the randomizing is a good idea, which isn't hard to implement, so we'll have to wait for Jhonn in that regard. In a nutshell: 3 videos(embedded) and unlimited screenshots, right? -[[User:Garteal|Garteal]] ([[User talk:Garteal|talk]]) 12:11, 11 November 2012 (CET)

Take a look at [[Template:VideoGallery/test]], is the SSBB page using the standard I'm suggesting. It's already using the random thumbnails feature, but if you guys want to see another example in how the [[Template:VideoGallery|video gallery template]] works, take a look at [[Xenoblade Chronicles]]. Well, what do you guys think about this standard? I think we can already start using it. - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

Well, personally, I still prefer smaller thumbnails for screenshots. The goal is to have a fair amount of them, and we could end up with quite a few. Plus the isolation between screenshots and videos is very clean and organized. And well, I just think it looks nice. So, in my opinion, I'd rather we go with something other than the media gallery. As such, I'll suggest an alternative like what I proposed before: 200px thumbnails for screenshots in a gameplay screenshots section, and then the youtube template with 3 ~300px videos and then links in a gameplay screenshots section. Let's see what everyone thinks between the two of them. And no matter which standard we go with, you did awesome work Jhonn. - [[User:MaJoR|MaJoR]] ([[User talk:MaJoR|talk]]) 01:46, 14 November 2012 (CET)

: Ok, my only request is to ALWAYS use the [[Template:Image|image template]] or one of the two video templates (using [[Template:VideoGallery|video gallery template]] only if the page have more than 3 videos), no matter which standard we go with. The thumbnail size can easily edited, directly in the template, by replacing the 300px tag with the desired size and changing the 275px tag with the desired size minus 25px (for example, to make the template generate 200px thumbnails, we should have 200px in the first tag and 175px in the second). This request is to make quicker fixes in future (like what was done with testing section) and because using the <code>&lt;gallery&gt;&lt;/gallery&gt;</code> tags or calling embedvideo directly gave me countless issues with floating elements and made the thumbnails size be "fixed" with a smaller size, even when specifying a higher width... - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

: Ok, this is the standard. We can start commiting this standard in the game pages. I'll make the [[Template:Image]] more configurable when I have free time, specifically, to don't include the caption (screenshot only mode) via a template parameter... For now, just use the template without any tag in the second parameter, when I implement this, the caption space will be automatically wiped out) - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

::: We should use the video gallery only if the game page have more than 3 videos... The rest of the pages, with 3 videos or less, should just use the YouTube template... I think there is no way of checking this instead of manually checking every game page to see which page have more than 3 vidoes, and then, updating it to the video gallery template =/    [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

That's it. I already fixed everything in the templates and updated [[Template:VideoGallery/test]] to fit in this standard, I think this should be the standard template, so we can start commiting this damn thing in all pages (c'mon guys, this discussions is taking too many time!) But since this is a community driven project, I'll ask again: what do you guys think about this standard? Any objection? - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:Works for me. It's very easy to use, I like it. I have one tiny nitpick though: is it necessary to  have the "cap" separated in the video template? Stuff like '''<nowiki>|vid1=R9u_BJXRyuI|cap1=super smash bros brawl in 3d dolphin emulator</nowiki>''' could very easily be '''<nowiki>|vid1=R9u_BJXRyuI|super smash bros brawl in 3d dolphin emulator</nowiki>''' instead, unless there is something in the template to prevent it of course. It's just a little nitpick. Awesome work on the templates Jhonn. - [[User:MaJoR|MaJoR]] ([[User talk:MaJoR|talk]]) 23:22, 19 November 2012 (CET)

::Well, the way how templates work doesn't allow it. I can get parameters without any prefix by using {{{1}}}, {{{2}}}, etc, but since the template randomly select one of the N videos that have been included, I cant "find" the number that correspond to the capN parameter of the selected video (because this number vary depending in which entry the template randomly selected). To avoid these kind of issues, we need to declare the parameters, allowing to get the capN by using {{{capN}}} regardless of what location it's defined, so, from my knowledge, there is no way of implementing this... - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:Unless delroth is able to filter the rest of the screenshots out, we might have to limit the screenshots, since it'll really mess up the game threads in the forums. As for the video section, are you able to ''hide'' the rest of the links, leaving only the embedded videos visible? That would make things much cleaner, and will let you put the video section above the screenshot section, since it'll be a hassle to scroll down to the video section if the screenshot section becomes huge. Last, but certainly not least, I would like to say you've done an amazing job with the video template Jhonn. [[User:Garteal|─ Garteal]] ([[User talk:Garteal|talk]]) 16:13, 20 November 2012 (CET)

:: I've updated the [[Template:VideoGallery/test]] with you suggestion Garteal. Looks good to me, because it already prevent any future issues with the Gallery standard if we have too many videos or too many screenshots. So, I'll commit this to [[Project:Wiki Conventions]] and then, we can start using this as the final standard for the media gallery... - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:: Wich other services? The template itself already support other video services (just add srvN=<name of the service> before video ID. In the first time, I need to create a copy of youtube template modified for other services, but this can be done in no time... Well, to prevent any future issue, I'll add the initial template for all services, ok? [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

::: Ok, almost all services supported by EmbedVideo plugin can be used with [[Template:VideoGallery]] now. Edutopia service wasn't added because this site simply embed videos from YouTube. Revver and TeacherTube weren't added because these services doesn't exist anymore. FunnyOrDie and Vimeo were added but EmbedVideo plugin is outdated, generating broken thumbnails (these 2 services works only in "link mode"). Sevenload wasn't added because this site doesn't work here where I live (Brazil), so I couldn't access the site to get a sample video link and add support... [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:::: Thanks Jhonn, now we just need to update the VideoGallery docs to indicate the services availible. I had been noting pages that used alternate video services, but I'm away from home for Thanksgiving so it may be a while before I'd get to accounting for them to use embeds [[User:Kolano|Kolano]] ([[User talk:Kolano|talk]]) 18:48, 22 November 2012 (CET)

While working on the Dolphin Manual I've realized that it's going to have content box that will GIGANTIC. The biggest content box on the wiki ever. It will be even worse than the [[FAQ]]. I need a way to deal with this. Looking around, I found this: [[wikipedia:Template:TOC limit]] on wikipedia. It looks extremely simple, with very short code, and it would help. Honestly I'd rather have a put the TOC into the sidebar, like the mainsite's faq, but since we can't do that... this will do. Do you guys have any better ideas, or should I go on ahead and try this template? (and inevitably break something and need Jhonn to bail me out :P) - [[User:MaJoR|MaJoR]] ([[User talk:MaJoR|talk]]) 06:47, 18 April 2013 (CEST)  

: Well, this fix the issues with the big TOC, so, you should try... The template is very simple, the only possible issue would be with our custom CSS schemes, but it should work without any problem - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:: Ok, implemented it. Luckily, the template didn't cause issues with our custom CSS schemes (YAY!) [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:::: Don't be scared guy, found a template, implement it. Caused issues or broke things? Don't worry, sooner or later somebody will help fixing it, after all, it's a community! It's the best way of learning, when the wiki was born (mid-2010, in Mamario's server), I spent a looong time breaking things when implementing templates, and almost all times I needed Kolano, Keller999 and ThatLuciano to fix up the mess. You'll see, soon you'll be creating/implementing very complex templates without any issues =D - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:Really cool, but the main site is multilingual and the wiki is English only... How we'll address that? Also, maybe we can remove the wiki's FAQ now since the FAQ of the main site is multilingual and the one in the wiki is just a duplicate, and english only... What do you guys think? [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:::Don't worry. However, my only suggestion here is using subpages instead of separate ones, like what we do with the Navigation template (eg. "Performance guide/en", "Performance guide/de", "Performance guide/fr") [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

::: We should have done this a long time ago, the wiki FAQ always had duplicated content, even when the site was hosted in Mamario's servers. Delete the Wiki FAQ!!! [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:::::: Deleted the wiki FAQ, and redirected to the mainsite FAQ. I have access, so if you see something just let me know. Delroth is going to be away for a while, but other devs have access to the site, so it shouldn't be too difficult to add someone if you ask. I see no reason why you guys (Jhonn and Kolano) couldn't be given access to the mainsite FAQ to help out. - [[User:MaJoR|MaJoR]] ([[User talk:MaJoR|talk]]) 22:51, 23 April 2013 (CEST)

:A rough approach would be filtering games that doesn't use AX UCode (Zelda, Mario Galaxy, etc.) and then crossing out all HLE problems in all game pages... It'll be easier to filter out games that doesn't use AX UCode than filtering games that use it... -[[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

: Ok, did some tweaks: all navigation templates are expanded by default and "view" link was removed. I agree with MaJor regarding to the title row, it should stay as is. I won't implement a cookie to store "hide/show" preference because it would be a lot of work for something that shouldn't be cared about. And since the code used to implement the functionality of the hide/show buttons are shared by a lot of templates, I can't remove it from navbar without breaking the show/hide functionality of Test Entries and the "contents" chart. Also, moving the talk and edit links to the upper-right corner caused a lot of issues with the positioning of show/hide button, so I'm just leaving it in the default position. - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:: Fixed for real now - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

: Also, adding all banner images in a category would be nice, like [Category:Banner images]. Well, I'll try to exemplify this in a sandbox... [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

Then, delroth could hotlink the banner images from wiki, this way we could share only one copy of the banner in the main site and in the wiki aswell. [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

: "Banner images" seems a more accurate category. We can move them to the new category, as we have only a few images uploaded... - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:: Tried in a sandbox and the infobox got somewhat "ugly" (at least in my opinion). If we're going to use the banner in infobox, putting only one banner image in "see also" section (before the links) seem better. - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:: Well, from what I've seen, all banner images delroth got with "bannerget" were extracted directly from the Dolphin's cache file, so, it's compressed only one time. - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:: Yep, this is true... Completely forgot the loading times when I suggested this - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

::::The list table is rendered through MediaWiki markup, I'm unsure if we can mess CSS sprites with MediaWiki formatting without major issues. However, if this can be done without loading issues, the main list is the best way for having the banner images (better than in infobox VG) - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

What about using more questions (randomly selecting one of them each time) or using a captcha method based on mouse input only, like these simple jigsaw puzzle based? Right now I remember of KeyCaptcha, but AFAIK it isn't free... [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

I'm not sure where we could put this, but my only suggestion for now is having a entry in the Infobox of games that have WFC capabilities. For functionalities that may need a NAND dump (like getting DLC) we could "rate" as good and then put a small note or tooltip. What about that? [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:: What about something like the ratings template? You put a number in a template subpage with the name of the game and then in the infobox we display a small text (rather than stars). I'm willing to maintain games that I own (if we proceed implementing this), but if only one person is going to handle this then the amount of work needed to implement the functionality doesn't compensate. Any other idea to simplify this to an easier way of managing? [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:Hm, I liked... I can help with the templates, and if we change the main [[Virtual Console]] page to grid of buttons (like the main page), I can delete some crappy templates we've around here (some unfinished work that I didn't touch in the last 2 years -- completely useless now). Also, since we're going to do major changes in the main [[Virtual Console]], we could implement also an infobox with common information about the service, like the infobox we got in GameCube and Wii page. Regardless of what we do, I'm in with this whole thing - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 22:29, 5 March 2013 (CET)

Let'me know what you guys think, I'll do my best to make this template this week... [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

About the global problems, yes, we add the problems one time in {{tl|globalproblems}} and the template code does the linking. We can have sections for problems of every platform and global problems all in the main {{tl|globalproblems}} or have subsections for every platform ({{tl|globalproblems/NES}}, {{tl|globalproblems/N64}}, etc -- like what we do with navigation template). [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

I looked up reviews on almost all of the udraw games. I couldn't find ''a single one'' that used the buttons on the Wii Remote. Reviewers even commented about this, for example asking why a platformer game was controlled with the stylus when there was a dpad right there. To my knowledge, the udraw games do not use the wii remote ''at all''. And yea, I agree with you on the sideways wiimote bit. I never really found a way to handle it though. Well, I really like the control config setup. It's very useful. And it usually isn't that difficult to figure out "Wiimote and nuchuk" 99% of the time means "wiimote + nunchuk" for example. Well, perhaps we should move this to the general discussions page, and try to get Jhonn's opinion? - [[User:MaJoR|MaJoR]] ([[User talk:MaJoR|talk]]) 00:34, 22 May 2013 (CEST)

Well, I think we should list all required inputs. For example, Classic controller needs Wii Remote to function properly, so, list Classic Controller and Wiimote, the same for uDraw tablet. Also, my suggestion for required and optional inputs would be using icons for all inputs (even the optionals), something like what we have on WiiBrew wiki (here is [http://www.wiibrew.org/wiki/Deadly_Cobra_Wii an example] -- the infobox has a lot of icons, we could get only input related ones). This "design" can also provide visual feedback about how many controllers are supported in multiplayer and if the game uses sideways wiimote, etc. This would require a major rewrite of the wiki pages, but I think it's our best bet, since we don't have a standard for input listings. Also, since we don't have a documented "standard" right now, we can create one now and list it in [[Project:Wiki conventions]]. Furthermore, the input icons used in WiiBrew are using Creative Commons license, we could use (or create our icons based on it) without copyright/licensing issues... [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

Well, in this case, List only uDraw Game Tablet and Classic Controller separated and add the combination system to all pages (to the VC games too). Whatever we do, add documentation to it somewhere to prevent future issues. Another option, if we're going to use the icons, is "merging" normal icons to represent combinations (like wiimote + nunchuck), but in this case, we leave Classic controller and uDraw as a separate icon, without combining them with wiimote... [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

: We should inform delroth, since the links works and are parsed correctly when we are in the wiki, this probably is an issue with the "wiki => forum" rendering engine. [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])  

: Well, I'm in with it. About rating 4 and 5, I think that if a game need an extreme setting (interpreter, LLE, EFB to Ram uncached, MMU), we should mark it as 4. Otherwise, mark it as 5. And for graphical related issues, if the problem is backend specific and the issue can be fixed by using OpenGL (that works Windows/Mac/Linux), we should mark as 5, otherwise mark it as 4. Despite this two notes, I agree with the rest - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:: I agree with Jhonn on this. I'd even go further and say games that require interpreter, video software or full MMU+TLB emulation (=> no way to run even at 50% speed on any current computer) should be marked as 2 (unplayable) instead of 4. LLE, EFB to Ram uncached should be 4. Not sure about Single Core / SyncGPU. Please tell me when you reach a decision, I'll need to update the website to match that. [[User:Delroth|delroth]] ([[User talk:Delroth|talk]]) 14:14, 25 August 2013 (CEST)

What about using more questions (randomly selecting one of them each time) or using a captcha method based on mouse input only, like these simple jigsaw puzzle based? Right now I remember of KeyCaptcha, but AFAIK it isn't free... [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:::::Just a heads-up, two players on one controller does fall in the new section, SSBB allows mixing Wiimotes with GC Controllers in real hardware, it's not Dolphin fault if the user configured the same bindings for both GCPad and emulated Wiimote. This also covers cases like [[Tatsunoko vs. Capcom: Ultimate All-Stars]] (which clearly says at the beginning that you can't use a Wiimote while a GC controller is plugged) and [[Sonic Riders: Zero Gravity]] (which already have a problem entry for that issue -- it should go in a new section). Said that, "Emulation Info" sounds kinda wrong for me (native 16:9 and mixing controllers can be done in real hardware too) so I would choose Common Misconceptions/Mistakes. And what about listing that section before Problems/Global Problems? Users having those common issues would quickly find the info they need without reading/rolling through all other problems (useful in pages with long problems, like F-Zero GX or SSBB). Thoughts? - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:::::::::Just to make sure, are you suggesting Emulation Issues or you're OK with Emulation Information?  - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:::::::::::Um... I don't care? By consensus the new section already is official, I was just asking MaJoR specifically about her thoughts of the new section naming. - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

To finish, we already are discussing a new section for problems that aren't really problems (native 16:9, mixed controllers, etc), which looks waaaay better than this and just reinforces my point of you trying to fix a non-existent problem with this template. - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

::<nowiki>*sigh*</nowiki> And not related to this but why you also want to convert problems into banners? Dual-Layer games already have its own category which is easy to reach from the bottom of the page, GC games with 16:9 native support already have an entry in problems section and in those cases both will be moved to the new Emulation Info/Common Misconceptions (or whatever name we choose) and can also be accessed through its own categories. And about your complaint regarding unnecessary edits, font problem in Sonic Mega Collection was moved back and forth because of my initial complaints about the subject but eventually settled in Problems section. How this template or your banners-that-go-before-anything-else would have improved this particular case? Just stop, you made an ugly proof of concept where I can't see any way to improve, nor it provides anything better than the new section we're discussing in [[Talk:F-Zero GX]], not to mention you didn't provide any feasible reason. Unless other admins (MaJoR, Kolano) or active members like Lucario weight in pointing something positive in favouring this approach, you can consider this whole "problem rating" thing something that won't go anywhere else besides the F-Zero GX sandbox. ''If it ain't broke, don't fix it'' - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

::::To finish, you still failed to provide any benefit of using {{tl|RatingProblemFix}} and none of the other active admins/members shared thoughts in favour of this template, so, still don't expect this template going anywhere else besides the sandboxes, as far as I'm concerned. And about Template:WidescreenGCN and Template:DualLayerWiiDiscs, they should go as well, I suggest you trying something like peripherals section of Homebrew Channel infobox. - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

::::::::* That's exactly my point, that "vital" information isn't that important (especially in the infobox), the icons with mouse-hover still looks like the best approach for me (especially when this kind of info will probably be detailed in the new Emu Info section as well). You can try a "NAND Warning from WiiBrew" concept to show us how they would look, just don't forget they use a slightly small font and no icons at all (and even that, still draws more attention than it should, in my opinion). [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:It's Ok for me as it is now, my only requirement is converting your table into a template before implementing it everywhere: theoretically it's something we're gonna use in various pages (assuming everyone else agrees and we actually implement it), so, making it as a template allow us doing quick edits in the future that would reflect in every page using this box. - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

: As far as I remember, we sticked with Emulation Information above problems but I'm not sure either (would have to dig into that long discussions -- too lazy to do that now). So, I think we should put it above. Yes, they're minor, but it's also some very common problems, thus, it's what the user wold read first if they have issues with a bad dump (SSBB case), problems with widescreen hack (GC games with native support) or controller issues (Wii games), providing information quicker instead of rolling through the entire problems section, that can take a big amount of space (e.g. Wind Waker, which have lots of problems listed). And since emulation information isn't a section that's going to be crowded (so far I haven't saw any page with more than two small entries) I think it's a win-win case (the full page would be something like Emu Info => Global Problems => Problems => Enhancements => Config => Version Compat => Testing => Gameplay Screens => Gameplay Videos => Navigation -- Emu Info and Enhancements only present in pages that have suitable entries, Global Problems only in VC pages and Navigation only where applicable). - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

It's a little redundant but this design make sure that all Dolphin users will see these problems, even people who jumps directly in the game page through the Wiki context menu present in Dolphin itself. Furthermore, [[The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask]] is already using the global template and I'm going to remove that "test issue" from the VC global templates soon, I need it for testing. Before committing this to the other platforms, I'll (try to) fix all spacing problems and make the template source more readable, but I need feedback here, any objection or suggestion? [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

:Forgot something, the placement: Global Problems should be before or after the Problems section? [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

So Jhonn, finished? It seems like you got it; it's fully functional and very easy to use. As far as I'm concerned, add documentation and you're done. Anything else you want to do with it before we put it everywhere? - [[User:MaJoR|MaJoR]] ([[User talk:MaJoR|talk]]) 10:18, 12 August 2013 (CEST)

: Yep, finished... I'll add the search-and-replace strings in [[Project:To Do]], so you could ask delroth for the script. If the automation fails, then tell us and we go in the manual way. [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

::: Thanks delroth. Only two pages already had the GlobalProblems (I commited manually to test), so, no worry. I reverted some pages that we're using Arcade category but weren't Virtual Console Arcade games, so everything is perfect now. Thanks again... [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

Splitting this to get more attention. Well, I started coding the global problems template for VC games, and before I continue the work, I need to get opinion of you guys regarding how we'll handle the universal problems in every VC game page. First off, I fell this necessary because some users just jump directly in the game page through context menu option in the emulator or by the forum thread, so, we need to add the universal problems in the game page too. Regardless of what design we choose, we'll need to add a template call in every VC game page (yes, it's a booooring job that has to be done -- at least there aren't to much VC game pages created). But before I continue working in the template, we need to decide how we'll show this, and I have two suggestions: first, calling the template without an argument (eg. in a game page) create a section named "Global Problems", and parse the problems for that system. The second one, is adding the template call after the specific problems, this way, the global problems will just appear together with the specific problems. Do you guys have any other suggestion? What you prefer? I vote for the first one... [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

Furthermore, the global problems will be shown before or after the specific problems? I think before is better, so we have Global Problems section (it'll show only if there are at least one global problem for that platform), and after that, the regular Problems section like we have now. What do you guys think? [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

Well, once we get everything settled, I can send delroth an email about the script. Or perhaps it's better if you do it Jhonn? You are more involved with the template. - [[User:MaJoR|MaJoR]] ([[User talk:MaJoR|talk]]) 04:36, 4 August 2013 (CEST)

:Well, I'll just wait a bit more to get Kolano opinion and then finish the template. After that we see how we'll handle the migration... [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

Well, just a reminder: when you add/remove a problem from some Global Problem template, it will not show the recent edit. After you're done, make sure to click "Edit" and then save the page again (without doing any change) one more time to force refresh the templates. It seems that just waiting the wiki server refresh the page isn't working, maybe because the extensive use of variables... [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

: I liked the concept, but I'm unsure on how to grab the testing entries... Not sure if there's a way to share testing entries between pages without needing major rewrites in testing template code. - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]])

And well, there's a single disadvantage, but given the benefits I think it's perfectly doable: the "[edit]" button disappears from the individual entries, but you can still find it under the main "Problems" section. So, given the benefits, I almost started implementing this everywhere, but it's a somewhat big change, so I would like to hear any thoughts you guys might have before starting (especially from [[User:Kolano]] and [[User:MaJoR]]). - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 07:56, 19 November 2016 (CET)

::: I particularly don't. I intentionally left the main "Problems" heading out of the template so we can get the "[edit]" button on it at least (e.g. similar to config template). If we insert it into the template the button will be gone and so edits in the problems section would be less obvious on [[Special:RecentChanges]], outsiders might not understand why the other sections have edit buttons while Problems doesn't, etc etc. Regarding flagging pages with active problems but without issues, <s>I think it's doable by using #varfinal, I'll try to get that working</s> Seems more tricky than I thought, but I think I can still find a way to do this by messing with RegExp capture groups, stay tuned - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 04:09, 20 November 2016 (CET)

::: I agree with Jhonn, it'd be less consistent with other heading 2 sections (== text ==) and thus will confuse the editors. I'm perfectly fine with heading 3 sections (=== text ===) to not have edit button, that will be great for edit summary too, we don't need to see some obscure problem name but something we're very familiarized with, "Problems". [[User:Lucario|Lucario]] ([[User talk:Lucario|talk]]) 05:40, 20 November 2016 (CET)

Okay, it's done. Flagging pages with active problems but without issue links was harder than I though but it's now implemented. Basically it does a RegExp query to find how many active problems the page has (it does that by "counting" level 3 headings without <nowiki><s></s></nowiki>) and after that it loops through the text of each "active" heading it found earlier querying for "<nowiki>[https://dolp.in/i<number>]</nowiki>" (it wasn't possible to search for {{tl|issue}} calls directly because the template was parsed before the RegExp query). Although it currently does that lookup only on active problems, I left in the template some "base" code enabling us to do the same with fixed problems as well, if we need (maybe tagging pages with fixed problems without a revision link? Not sure if that is useful but it's that kind of thing which is possible to do). TL;DR, it outputs a nice text saying there are no problems if the section is empty and accurately flag pages under [[:Category:Pages with active problems]], [[:Category:Pages with fixed problems]], [[:Category:Pages with active problems missing issue links]] or [[:Category:Pages with misformatted problems]] without needing additional templates like {{tl|s}}, {{tl|/s}}, {{tl|active}} and {{tl|fixed}} or the workaround in {{tl|issue}}. If there's nothing more you guys want to ask or to add on {{tl|Problems}}, I'll start implementing it on all pages... - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 06:40, 23 November 2016 (CET)

::: Done. Refer to [[Kirby's Adventure]], [[Super Ghouls 'n Ghosts]] or [[Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars]] to see {{tl|Problems}} behavior on different scenarios when used on VC pages. Is there anything else you guys want? - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 16:39, 24 November 2016 (CET)

::::: Global Problems are (and always were) taken into consideration when assigning a rating, and as I said in the edit summary, the message shown here can be tweaked. BTW, I'm not sure if the issue tracker should be linked here either, AFAIK the devs intentionally made it not too evident (not even the main website links to it after all) - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 00:44, 25 November 2016 (CET)

: Thanks for the heads-up. Since this is something potentially useful, I requested to one of the guys who maintain the website to install this extension, but he's away and so it will take some days until he can install it to us. In the mean time, I think you can use the [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:DynamicPageList3 DPL3 extension] we have on this wiki to generate a report of pages which intersect as workaround. [[User:Kolano|Kolano]] probably can help you more with its usage (you can also check any of the [[Template:Problems|Problems]] templates for usage examples as they also uses DPL3 extension). - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 21:24, 12 September 2016 (CEST)

:So, what's the plan? Wait until 5.0 is out officially to start purging <s>crossed</s> entries? Or start right now? I have some free time during this week, so I can help with the purging... - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 05:05, 15 June 2016 (CEST)

:::Since we isolated crossed entries on a separate category, I'm pretty sure we can do that with some RegExp trickery. But then, some issues that can still happen when opening the graphics configuration window would be purged too (the ones that were crossed). If we're really going to automate it, we should go through the pages manually to check that case you noted before starting... - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 08:57, 15 June 2016 (CEST)

::: Well, since we're running out of time, I think I can isolate pages from the [[:Category:Pages with fixed problems]] that have references to graphics settings with some special searches. After filtering out those pages we could proceed with the mass purge and decide later what to do on the remaining pages with issues that can still happen when opening the graphics configuration menu. I personally think that moving those problems to Emulation Information may be a good deal (similar to the Bounding Box entries on Paper Mario games -- they are already listed on Emulation Information). What do you think? - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 02:10, 17 June 2016 (CEST)

A quick update: by purging the global problems templates, the number of pages with fixed issues dropped to 275 from the previous 700+ (YAY!). Before filtering the crossed issues related to opening graphics settings, I tried to use RegExp to automatically purge the remaining entries (just a test) and... Database Error. Apparently the RegExp sentence is somehow too complex and we can't proceed. I'll contact Parlane to see if he can do something about that, in the worst scenario I'll start purging manually (fortunately the number of pages with <s>crossed</s> entries isn't that big) - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 07:01, 18 June 2016 (CEST)

::Actually that was expected, as the name implies, those global problems are shown in every single Virtual Console game page. And regarding RegExp issue, Parlane is now aware and will look into it soon... - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 08:27, 18 June 2016 (CEST)

Another quick update: the Replace Text plugin we were using only supported a limited subset of RegExp functions and that's what was causing the problems. After some discussion with Parlane, Replace Text plugin was dropped and now we have [[Special:MassEditRegex|MassEditRegex]] instead (and as usual, only accessible by admins). MassEditRegex doesn't have the limitations from Replace Text and I'm almost ready, I'll probably start the purging later today. Oh, and I almost forgot, edits made through MassEditRegex are marked as bot edits, so they won't spam [[Special:RecentChanges]] unless you explicitly ask it to show bot edits. - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 03:13, 20 June 2016 (CEST)

: Okay, I pressed the red button, mass edits finished and apparently everything went well. There are some pages that used non-standard formatting and thus didn't get caught on the RegExp query or that have issues that can still happen when opening the graphics configuration menu. Since the number of pages needing special treatment seems very small, I'll take care of them manually now, everything regarding page purging should be done very very soon :) - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 04:01, 20 June 2016 (CEST)

:::... which essentially matched every entry in the format <tt>=== <nowiki>{{s}}whatever{{/s}}</nowiki> ===</tt> and then fixed the excess of line breaks left by the first expression. - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 05:54, 20 June 2016 (CEST)

::: For now I'm moving them to Emulation Information and tagging them with [[:Category:5.0 cleanup]] so we can track and make any edits after we discuss how we'll handle those. Also, I'm only moving those entries to emulation information if the game INI already include the settings, otherwise I'm just leaving it in Problems section (uncrossing it if necessary) - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 05:54, 20 June 2016 (CEST)

I finished the manual review, All pre-5.0 issues were purged from the wiki! At the same time, the number of pages in [[:Category:5.0 cleanup]] is smaller than I thought, so, if possible, please go through the recent edits to see if I didn't let anything slip out of my reviewing. Now it's just a matter of waiting the official 5.0 announcement to then update {{tl|Revision}} and {{tl|VersionRevision}} templates and the notice message at the top of our wiki and we're done! YAY! - [[User:Jhonn|Jhonn]] ([[User talk:Jhonn|talk]]) 07:54, 20 June 2016 (CEST)